“When starting a collaboration with a start-up, you should ask yourself the following three questions: Is it the right company, with the right technology, at the right time?”
In this episode, we catch up with Kelly Van Dyke, Director - R&D External Innovation at PepsiCo. Her mission: Identify new technologies to disrupt the CPG category through strategic partnerships and business opportunities and to drive product innovations that truly delight consumers.
This highly entertaining conversation focuses on PepsiCo's start-up collaborations. In addition to an introduction to the company's tripartite collaboration strategy, including a brief look at the partnerships between different areas of R&D, we also return to the PepsiCo Positive (pep+) Journey: A sustainable approach to creating growth and shared value with a focus on sustainability and human capital. Want to learn more about PepsiCo's projects with startups? Then grab your headphones and tune in!
Below you will find the full transcript for the episode.
PepsiCo and global R&D
Chris: Now on Innovation Rockstars. Hi and welcome back to Innovation Rockstars. My name is Chris Mühlroth and in this episode, I'm excited to welcome Kelly Van Dyke. Kelly is a director within the external innovation team for PepsiCo's global R&D organization. And right now she's accountable for identifying and driving technologies that are deemed to disrupt the wellness and health consumer packaged goods category through strategic partnerships and also business opportunities, of course. Kelly, happy to have you here. Thanks a lot for joining us.
Kelly: It's a pleasure. Absolutely. Me too. Happy to be here.
Chris: All right. So as always, we start straight away with a short 60 seconds introduction sprint. This is all about you, your career, your current role. So for the next 60 seconds, the virtual stage is all yours. I have a timer. Let's go.
Kelly: All right. So I'm Kelly. Like you said, I live in the Chicago area. Today is a snowy day. Two days ago, it was 60 degrees Fahrenheit. So that's winter and spring in Chicago. I have two kids and a husband. And my world, as I said, is R&D and external innovation or open innovation as it is more frequently known. I am scouting for new technologies with the intention that they can land inside of our R&D organization, driving really big step change from a technical perspective with the eventual goal that something new can come to the market and really delight consumers. And prior to that, I spent 15 years in product development across a large portion of our beverage organization and foods in a prior company prior to PepsiCo.
Chris: Thanks. That's great. And a lot of experience in the episode today. Thanks. So now to get you know, to just a little bit better, I do have three sentence starters for you. I would like to ask you to complete those sentence starters. Let's see what happens. Number one goes like this: My favorite song is...
Kelly: …whatever my kids are performing right now. So they both do School of Rock. My son plays electric guitar like you have hanging on your walls. My daughter sings. So whatever they're working on for their next performance. That's what I love.
Chris: Yeah. School of Rock. That's pretty cool. Pretty cool. Yeah. OK, cool. Number two: One personal or professional goal I'm currently working towards is...
Kelly: I'm going to go back to my kids again. They're getting older, and I feel like they're ready for a long flight. So my goal is to get them seeing the world and make it outside of the U.S. in the next year.
Chris: All right. That's awesome. That's actually, I guess, one of the most important things to teach kids. Right. Make sure they see what's out there. What else? What else is out there? I agree. Yes. Cool. OK. Number three, this could be controversial. Let's see. The sentence goes like this: One thing that I believe most people in my field, my professional field, would disagree with is...
Kelly: All right. I believe that you can actually design products for a global audience when done properly and out of the gate.
Chris: Wow. For a global audience, so not for specific regions or countries, but global audience. All right.
Kelly: I think OK, so global is probably an extension, but I believe you can create something to be a multi-market, meaning you can develop it out of the gate for the U.S. and a European country and something in South Africa all at the same time, if you do it properly.
Chris: But that's huge. All right. Well, let's maybe have a controversial conversation about that after the episode. Let's see. All right. So let's talk about PepsiCo for a while. I did some research and the numbers are actually quite impressive. Right. PepsiCo's products are enjoyed by more than one billion times a day. That's crazy. In more than 200 countries and territories around the globe, it generated, I just read this from some report, 79 billion in net revenue. Net revenue. 2021 driven by products that most of us know. It's Lay's, Doritos, Cheetos, Gatorade, PepsiCo, of course, Mountain Dew, SodaStream and the like. You know, I always wonder, what is one thing that most people probably don't know about PepsiCo?
Kelly: So what I have found when I talk to people, and I'm out or, you know, friends at a soccer game or football game or wherever I might be talking to folks, I find they don't realize the breath of the products that we have. So you listed the big ones there. But actually, we have many, many small and broad companies. We have a lot of local companies through acquisitions, small companies that we've bought in Brazil, for instance, where we're making fresh milk, and we're making fresh cheese, which is not something people generally associate with PepsiCo. We do have a lot of really healthy, nutritious, less snacky, but more food products in our portfolio. A lot of people don't realize that. I would say the second thing I find is that people also don't really realize how committed PepsiCo is to what we call our positive agenda. So our sustainability for the consumers, the world, the environment, the climate, we've made some very, very, very, from a technical perspective, difficult to achieve, but very important goals on reducing water, GHG, plastics, et cetera, from our world and from what we are doing, building, moving around the world. And we're making progress, and we're reporting it on an annual basis to show that we really are. We really mean it. We're not just saying it, but we're doing it.
Chris: Yeah, I mean, OK, sure. I mean, I just listed the obvious ones, right? So thanks pretty much, Spot, I listed just the obvious products. But you're absolutely right. I mean, the breadth, given that, you know, business conglomerates, it's just amazing. It's just incredible. And also, from what I understand, I guess there are multiple groups within PepsiCo that are looking for and at technologies and also external companies. Can you explain something about these groups and what the focus areas are of each of them?
Kelly: Absolutely. So as we talked about, I said in the R&D world, external innovation. So looking externally for technologies to land inside of R&D. And I think that point is one of the major differentiators. There are two other teams that we partner with quite, quite closely within our organization. On one side, we have a venturing group who is out looking for new companies, new businesses, generally selling something to the consumer. And they're looking for what's the new company, new product that consumers are pulling for. So they're looking more of a business facing experience. And what can they bring into the company in the portfolio that way? On the flip side, there's another group of folks called PEP Labs. They have a really beautiful outward facing website showing a lot of the technologies that they've done. They're partnering a lot with our IT, our supply chain, our marketing and testing new technologies that can help accelerate that part of the business. Really quick pilots. And it's fantastic. They're able to get so many great companies and so many great pilots and partnerships there. So we each have our own little space, but we work very closely together, always connecting and sharing companies across each other because we are looking we often, I'll put it this way, are tag teaming and sending each sending our partners to the same conferences and scout for me and tell me what you find and bring it all back.
Chris: Yeah, absolutely. Great. I can imagine. I mean, how large are the teams like in total, but also each team?
Kelly: Oh, to be honest, in the behemoth that is PepsiCo of I think we have nearly 300,000 employees. We are a small, small, small, small minority when you combine all of us together, you know, in the world of 5, 10, 15 employees in each of the different groups. So just a handful of us out there really seeing where the world is turning, like really taking that peek around the corner, and where do we think things are going to go, consumers are going to go, technology is going to go and so on…
Chris: Yeah, I know that that makes perfect sense. And, you know, after you brought in these, you know, technology signals or companies into the organization, obviously, there is then larger teams to take on that for sure. I mean, that team size sounds quite healthy, actually. And is there also something like a mission statement or a vision statement for the external innovation team and a maybe also an understanding, but maybe a statement how it actually contributes to the bigger picture.
Kelly: Yeah, we do have one, and we're actually in the middle of revamping it. And our goal is to really help accelerate our broader R&D organization through the identification of new technologies, as well as leveraging our outside in external intelligence with the scanning to help inform the rest of the R&D organization where we should be going. What should we be considering? What should we be thinking about?
External innovation at PepsiCo
Chris: Accelerate is, I guess, put very, nicely. You know, our our our CTO always says, you know, speed is one thing, but velocity is the thing we should go after because it adds the direction component to it. So accelerate is actually actually actually, I guess, a great, great word to use. And now I learn from you and also, I guess, from the website that is publicly accessible, that the external innovation team is leveraging an open innovation framework with, you know, four different steps. “Want”, “Find”, “Get” and “Manage. So it starts with “want”. Right. So defining high priority technology needs. How could you or how are these defined?
Kelly: Yeah, great question. So I think one of the key things to our role is we're not actually developing or delivering anything to the consumer at the end of the day. Anything we find and identify is in service of our R&D partners. So that means our beverage category, who's working on products globally around the world, our foods, partners who are doing the same, as well as our compliance and government affairs. That group, we call that our technical data and compliance team. We are working in service of them. So that means we need to work with them to say, what are your big challenges? What are your big priorities? What are your objectives for this year? And how can we help you again, accelerate, meet your goals and get it done faster with the most efficient way possible with your teams? So that's how we have been working, generating those priorities.It's really in service and in partnership with our team, with our R&D team.
Chris: Yeah. OK, cool. So they have the need to basically, you know, pick them up. And make sure you look for solutions. And also outside to the company, obviously. And what are the other stages like “Find”, “Get” and “Manage”? This is obviously then subsequently happening to, you know, defining the “Want” and the direction you need to you need to tap into.
Kelly: Absolutely. So once we've generated the list of, you know, here's the three, four, five things this year, this team is really going to focus on going on and finding. The finding is then leveraging our network. And with our team, we've done a couple of things. One, we all come in with very different backgrounds. We all have different technical expertise that we bring to the group because we want to all be different and be able to cover the entirety of our R&D organization. We need to have different expertise. So that's one thing. So with that comes our own individual networks. We all have our networks of people, researchers, universities, whomever they might be. We're also leveraging conferences and going out and just boots on the ground, meeting people, talking to people. So we're leveraging those groups that we bring together, boots on the ground, as well as our partnerships, actually with our venturing team and with the pep labs team. So getting us closer into some of the venture capital world, the private equity world that's out there, accelerators, incubators, connecting with them and really expressing loudly what it is that we're looking for and helping together bring forward different opportunities or leads, as we call them. So finding the ecosystem people is probably the where we as a team bring the biggest value because we have such broad network that we collectively are able to leverage.
“We all have different technical expertise that we bring to the group because we want to all be different and be able to cover the entirety of our R&D organization and finding the ecosystem people is probably the where we as a team bring the biggest value.”
Chris: I was just about to say that this sounds like obviously the external ecosystem is extremely broad and also diverse. You said you have universities, you have, of course, professional partners, you have probably also partnering companies, startup ecosystem and the like. So there is a lot to tap into. Is there any specific way how you decide when to tap into what kind of network? Do you just broadcast out there, tell them, hey, guys, we look for this and that? Give me your ideas. Or is it, I don't know, an open innovation portal existing? I don't know something. Or is it just by, hey, I know these and these guys, let's talk to them. Be fast, be quick. And then, you know, bring things to the table. How do you operate typically when reaching out to the broader ecosystem?
Kelly: We use all of that, to be honest, and more. So, yes, we actually do have the portal that you've seen. We have we work with some partners for open submissions. So things on our list that we would consider evergreen, things the company is continually looking for, continually looking for sugar reduction technology, salt reduction technology, fat reduction technology. You can submit it to us through our open innovation portal, and it will make it to us. We'll scan the technology, see if it fits with what we're trying to do and connect it again into our organization. So that those are the evergreen things. I would say if we get some asks where we, hey, we've worked on this before, and we get a lot of those, we've worked in this space before. We have an internal database that we manage for every company that we've ever spoken to. We can quickly go back through the database and say, hey, here's 7, 8, 10 companies in that space that we've connected with through the years. They're a good start for you. So that's those are some quick and easy ways on the in the middle bucket, I think, is the more active space. So it's a bigger hurdle. What's what we know today is not necessarily an easy thing to do. We're probably going to have to create something with someone. So that's where it's really let's be very clear and define what is success looking like. What are we trying to develop? How are we trying to bring it to life? And then we'll proactively in partnership with those folks, talk to many different companies, figuring out what the different capabilities are, where are the gaps from what they have to what we need, and how do we need to develop something together? So it depends on the approach that we need and what is the solution that we're looking for in that particular instance.
Chris: Yeah, that's that's a great answer, because I think, of course, you tap into the external ecosystems for sure, and then make sure you're approaching the right people, the right networks, the right whatsoever. But at the same time, you know, a company as PepsiCo or a conglomerate such as PepsiCo most likely has a lot of lessons learned internally, probably a vast database of, as you say, startups, things you tried in the past that didn't work. Also, intelligence on, you know, patents or IP intelligence from both you or yourself, but also competition. So, you know, if you tap into that prior to also reaching out or in parallel to reaching out to the network, obviously, there are many things to be found, I guess. So that's actually great. Great to hear. And when we specifically focus on startups, I learned you talk quite a lot and also publicly about, you know, lessons learned in collaborating with startups, because it's a different world. Right. Obviously, you have those startups out there. They are sometimes they're small, sometimes they're VC backed, sometimes they're bootstrapped, but they of course operate by nature in a different way than, you know, larger companies for sure. Can you maybe share your lessons learned in collaborating with startups? And also, how did you learn them? That's also maybe an interesting, interesting thing.
Collaborating with startups: Lessons learned
Kelly: So, yeah, it's collaborating with startups is a different world. You're right. So a couple, I would say two big lessons learned that I have found and seen through either experience myself and feeling it and watching my partners and peers in the external innovation team working. One, it's really about the right company, right technology for the right stage. This is really, really important. So when you're thinking about the problem that your partner has brought to you, is it something that for us, where are we going to apply it, and how are we going to apply it. If we're going to put it onto a line that's manufacturing Lay's potato chips? Guess what? That company had better be able to produce a lot at scale, rapidly to hit all of our lines globally, because we make it the same around the world. That is a very different instance than I'm building a new business, and I'm going to venture into a new product category that our consumers don't think of us in today. Then I have a much different need from the consumer and I have a much therefore different need from volumetrically. How perfect does it have to be? I don't have a gold standard I'm trying to match. I have a little bit of good enough able to happen and go on with it. And therefore, I could probably leverage a startup much more so than one of our big established brands. That's a very different stage for what I mean. And so that goes back to right stage, right work, right partner is super important to plug that in. Otherwise, everyone's just going to be frustrated on all sides, the startup ourselves internally. So that's super important to think about. And the other thing where you have identified, hey, this is a great place for a startup. And we think that it's a good partnership to benefit both of us. I think it's really important to make sure everybody across the board knows it's going to feel different. And I was working on a project and someone was like, oh, my gosh, this feels different. I'm like, it is different because normally we're working with very large other multinational companies who have all the resources that PepsiCo has at their fingertips. So we ask for information. They can get it to us like this. This is a startup who is working in a kitchen, probably, and has a scale, maybe a kitchen scale, maybe a fancier one. We don't know. But we're going to have to figure out together. How do we get the answers that we want? Because you can't expect them to deliver everything that one of our big scaled vendors is able to deliver to us. So I think those are probably the two biggest lessons I would tell people to think about as you venture into partnering with startups.
“It comes down to the right stage, the right work, the right partner is super important to plug that in. Otherwise, everyone will be frustrated on all sides, the startup itself and us internally.”
Chris: Yeah, I guess that the first one, the first one is a spot on learning. The second one is something, you know, some probably forget from time to time, right, because it is just so into the hustle and daily work and daily operations of where you work right now. And then you encounter that, you know, startup situation where you say, OK, well, Jesus, this is completely different than I would have expected. And, you know, some do have it, some maybe not. But ultimately, you're working for, you know, you're looking for right stage work and also partner at the same time. So what is it? Patience? No, certainly not. Because startups can be very fast, but maybe they don't have all the information at hand. Is it more like acknowledging that this is different than, you know, setting the right expectations in the collaborating act?
Kelly: Yeah. So I would say patience is still an important part. And actually, it's patience from the startup. So I would often in our partnerships remind them, I know you're fast. And actually one in particular, I would joke with. We had a very good relationship. We would talk about something is OK. I need to go talk to the stakeholders and get an answer for you. And he would say, well, I'm 33 percent of the company, and I've given you a yes. And I said, well, I am point zero zero zero zero one percent of the company. And I've told you, I don't know. So back to you and the next person. So I think reminding them that you're going to have patience and operate at a much slower pace with us is super important. And to just remind them of that, the other piece that you asked around internally, and how do you manage that? I think what we've done is, or I've done, I should say, is the teams have come to us with this is how we want it to be. And I've said, great. Help me understand what is the absolute critical I must have, or the whole thing falls apart. What is the nice to have? Now, let's go back and start with the must-have. They don't have that capability. How else can we get it? Are we doing it? Are we giving them the name of someone? Are we helping them find a contractor? Let's find a solution, because guess what? They don't have a G.C. mass spec in their kitchen. So what's another option and how we get that information to you? And then let's work together to find it. So really reminding them over and over and over again, this is the expectations we need to have, because this is the environment that they're working in versus what we're working in. So let's have a little empathy for their life and figure out how we can get together to find a common solution.
“Patience is a very important part. And actually, it's patience from the startup. So I would often in our partnerships remind them, that I am aware that they are fast. But reminding them that they need patience as we are operating at a much slower pace is super important.”
Chris: Yeah, that makes perfect sense. And can we talk about a recent success story of external collaboration might be with a startup or anything else?
Kelly: Yeah, I am. So I will. I'll preface this by saying we keep most of our partnerships confidential. We do not announce very many of them. So I'm going to probably speak a little bit in generalities, but I'll have a specific or two and one agenda. I don't personally own it, but one of my partners own it. And it's very, very important to PepsiCo is our sustainable packaging agenda. And how do we get less plastic? How do we use less plastic? Certainly less virgin plastic, but moving to recycled plastic, bio P.E.T., possibly even pushing ourselves to a world where we're not even using plastic at all. Imagine what if we were selling all of those drinks and beverages that we have today, and we didn't sell any plastic with them? So how do we get on that journey? And we have certainly built a lot of partnerships along the way. Some out with a partnership with Origin that we have another one out with Pulpex, which is actually taking us in a very different direction. It's actually paper bottles. And what if we worked in a paper bottle space? And the beauty of that particular one that I love is it's actually we're working precompetitively with other multinational companies in different industries. So a company in the alcohol industry, a company in the personal beauty care industry. And we're all together working to see if we can elevate this paper bottle, because some of us are using it in very different ways. And all of us leverage the success of this one company. So those are a couple of examples recently in our sustainable packaging journey that we've been able to get some success on.
Chris: That's great. So this is around sustainable packaging, as is a bio P.E.T., maybe even plastic free going plastic free or, you know, some alternatives. And what are some other, you know, current technology needs or opportunities that you're after?
Kelly: Yeah, so sustainability. You heard me talk about the packaging side on our beverage side. We're constantly looking for what are our alternatives to foil packaging for snacks. Those have really caused us a lot of challenges on finding sustainable solutions. So certainly a big area we're looking at. When we look at e.g. sustainable e.g., regenerative e.g., we do actually go all the way back to the farm on some of our crops, our potatoes, our oats. We're working directly with the farmers and the GHG, the water usage, pesticides, all of that we know is a big problem for the environment. So we're going back there and saying, how can we find solutions in partnership with the farmers to help reduce those things and the pressure on the environment? So we're certainly looking for solutions in that space. I would say going in a completely different direction is digitization and the consumer journey and what their life is like interacting with our brands, with the products that they are eating, how do the availability of data that's out there? How do we leverage that data for more insights, and how do we increase and accelerate our ability to actually develop products based on the ability to now digitize information that historically has been someone looking at a screen and analyzing graphs and charts and data? How can we get that faster? It's just a handful off the top of my head.
The do's and don'ts about innovation
Chris: So that is a lot of work and a lot of opportunities, obviously, to tap into in the next few months, not so years, of course. That's great. Now, OK, you know, you shared your top two lessons learned in collaborating with startups. If we would zoom out just a bit and I would ask you if what is your number one ‘do’ and number one ‘don't’ about innovation, maybe more broadly than just collaborating with startups? What would you say number one ‘do’ and number one ‘do not’ about innovation?
“Always make sure you're keeping the consumer, the human that they are at the center of what you're driving, and you're delivering. I think that is so critical because solving for a problem that we think they have when they really couldn't care less is just a recipe.”
Kelly: Yes. So I'm going to break the rules and think and give you two ‘dos’ because that's, and I'll give you a ‘don't’, but I'm going to give you two ‘dos’. So the first thing on my ‘do’, I suppose, is: Think expansively. Think beyond the problem that you're given. Think about other ways you could solve it. Think about what if you turn the problem on the head? Could you find a really quick and easy solution? So really think expansively as you're talking about innovation. And then more specifically, I would say from a consumer perspective is make sure you're keeping the consumer, the human that they are at the center of what you're driving, and you're delivering. I think that is so critical because solving for a problem that we think they have when they really couldn't care less is just a recipe. So you have to you have to keep them at the center of all that. And I know I've been talking about sustainable agriculture and all of that, and that has nothing to do with the consumer. But that is my number one innovation ‘do’. My innovation don't is don't shut something down just because it's hard, hard for the company, hard for you. Really, again, prior statement, think expansively. And just because it's hard, it's hard how we do it today. What if we change something, and suddenly it became really easy to do, and it can be a huge unlock.
Chris: A huge unlock. So that's actually a very powerful combination because on the one hand, if there is something you want to achieve, make sure you can flip it around and, you know, provide something that is of value pretty fast and soon at the same time. You know, don't make it too complicated. And then, you know, make sure you focus on the customer. I totally agree as said, it's easy to say and easy to forget. Right. So maybe not for you, but I know, you know, situations where you say, OK, well, let's focus on the customer and now let's fix internal process first. Yeah. OK, sure. You can do that. But, you know, the customer ultimately might benefit from that, but maybe sometime down the line. So to remind yourself of that and the teams, I guess this is most important. I agree. I agree. Very cool. And if you look ahead, aside from the opportunities we discussed, OK, you know, around packaging, sustainability in general and the like. But what are some of the biggest challenges at the moment you're facing?
Kelly: To be honest with you, I think the challenges are I'll be very like zoomed in at the moment. There is so much pull and need for us to really help accelerate and think about how we operate from an R&D organization more quickly. We just don't have the time and the capacity and the people to solve it all. And we want to solve so much of it. So I think that's one challenge. I think on a bigger, more macro perspective, I think an industry-wide challenge is going back to the sustainability journey is “how are we going to solve this?”. And I was just looking at some data the other day on investment going into soil health and regenerative ag space. When you compare the amount of money going into that space from the public sector versus the private, meaning venture funding, corporate, private equity, IPOs, whatever it might be. The public money going into that space is dwarfed by the amount of private money. And which really resonated with me with something internally we've been speaking about is it really the responsibility of private companies to drive a change. And that graph, when you couldn't even see the line on a stacked bar chart of the money of a public went in, drove that point home. That it is really we all have to be a part of this solution. And the private companies are driving a lot of the cash. And therefore, we really have to drive the solutions to go with it.
Chris: So it will be private companies first, probably in that. OK, that's interesting. That's interesting that you mentioned this. Yeah. And on the internal challenge. So you mentioned that earlier. So is that ultimately a prioritization issue?
Kelly: Yeah, I don't think it's a problem. It comes down to prioritization. Yes. And then it's only a problem if someone says, “but they're all a priority”. And I say I need more people. So we'll see. We'll see if it's a problem.
Chris: Yeah. OK, understood. OK, now we are kind of close to the end of this episode already. Maybe two things in addition. Let's summarize and, you know, let's summarize three key actionable recommendations you want listeners to take away from this episode with you.
“Explore your own ideas. Explore your network more and really push yourself out there to see if you stepped outside your core network, just a little bit adjacent - what might you find?”
Kelly: I think it would be number one, keep the consumer at the heart of what you're doing, regardless of the type of innovation you're doing. Number two, I would tell you to really challenge yourself to look at the problem you're trying to solve at that moment from all the different angles and make sure you're removing the lens up. But this is how we do it. And just say, what's the problem, and how could I how can I solve it? And then a third actionable item, I think, explore your own ideas. Explore your network more and really push yourself out there to see if you stepped outside your core network, just a little bit adjacent. What might you find that you didn't see or know about before that you could leverage on how you do your work every day?
Chris: Yeah, yeah, understood. These are really actionable. All right. And, you know, before we end this episode, I do need to know: If you look, you know, on your professional career back then, what would you say was your greatest Innovation Rockstar moment to date?
Kelly: Ah, I have two, but I'll give you one because I will follow directions this time. It would actually be I led a phenomenal team when I was leading innovation for the Gatorade breakthrough product development team in the US. We were launching a lot of fantastic innovation at the time. But my rockstar moment would be the team that launched and developed in the US at Gatorade protein bar, 20 grams of protein, and it tastes like a Snickers bar. So good. Still on the market. It's doing fantastic. And people eat, and I'm like, “We did that! We did that!”. So that's probably one of my greatest rockstar moments.
Chris: Oh, that's cool. So next month, I'm going to be in the US. I definitely have to check this out. Love it. That's a great rockstar moment.
Kelly: Chocolate caramel. That's my favorite flavor.
Chris: I definitely have to try this out. And I'll tell you how it was, but I think I will love it. Now, that's it for this episode. Thanks so much again for being my guest. Really appreciate your taking the time. It was a pleasure to listen to you and to have you here.
Kelly: Thank you. I really enjoyed myself. Appreciate it.
Chris: All right. And to everybody listening or watching, if you enjoyed this episode, then feel free to leave us a comment on this episode or just drop us an email at info@innovation-rockstars.show. Now, that's it. Thanks for listening. Take care and bye-bye.
About the authors
Dr. Christian Mühlroth is the host of the Innovation Rockstars podcast and CEO of ITONICS. Kelly Van Dyke is Director - R&D External Innovation at PepsiCo.
The Innovation Rockstars podcast is a production of ITONICS, provider of the world’s leading Operating System for Innovation. Do you also have an eduspiring story to tell about innovation, foresight, strategy or growth? Then shoot us a note!
